Go Back   Science Forums Biology Forum Molecular Biology Forum Physics Chemistry Forum > General Science Forums > Biochemistry Forum > DNA Forum
Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

DNA Forum Discuss DNA, the molecule of hereditary. Topics include DNA structure, DNA replication, DNA function.


Counterargument evolution origin of life.

Counterargument evolution origin of life. - DNA Forum

Counterargument evolution origin of life. - Discuss DNA, the molecule of hereditary. Topics include DNA structure, DNA replication, DNA function.


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-29-2009, 06:25 AM
Pipette Filler
Points: 24, Level: 1 Points: 24, Level: 1 Points: 24, Level: 1
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default Counterargument evolution origin of life.



I got myself into a discussion between creationists and evolutionists. I myself am an evolutionist. I am not a biologist or a scientist in any way, hence I'm asking you for help.


So this creationist gave me an argument why Darwin could not be right.
What he said was in dutch, so I'll try to translate it:
Quote:
DNA is built upon amino acids. There are 20 different amino acids. amino acids can be created by nature.
Now we assume that a good protein is 300 amino acids long. Proteins are created by putting amino acids together. The chance that the right amino acid gets on the first place of a DNA string is about 1/20. The same for the next amino acid. Which means the total chance is (1/20)^300. Estimated is that the universe is 5 billion years old, which is 160 trillion seconds. I round up to 1000 trillion, I can give away a few trillion, you'll see later. Which means it's 10^15 seconds old.

The total amount of atoms in the universe is 10^80.
from here I really stop getting it so I'll translate litterally
one million reactions per second is 10^6 total. This makes it 10^103 chance, I need 10^390 which is 10^287 short. So basically the chance that dna created itself is REALLY REALLY SMALL
Is this a valid calculation? Is he correct or is he missing something?
Like I said, I don't know anything about this subject so I'd really appreciate your help!
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-03-2009, 02:13 PM
Volunteer
Points: 667, Level: 13 Points: 667, Level: 13 Points: 667, Level: 13
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 45
Thanks: 0
Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Default Re: Counterargument evolution origin of life.

Using that to support the idea that everything was created is not valid. It could be used to suggest that evolution might not be right, but does not prove his alternative. Science does not and cannot operate in this way. You draw a conclusion based on what you can find/observe not on what you can argue. That's why the adopted the Baconian approach to rid ourselves of the Aristotelian approach where if your argument was logically sound then it must be true.

His suggestion is flawed anyway as he's using straight randomness to give odds. He's ignoring the math behind self-replicating hypercycles.

He further doesn't understand the fundamental biology behind proteins and RNA/DNA. RNA was the first heritable molecule and it functioned to catalyze its own replication without proteins. Once that started...that took a billion years...everything else downstream had a template on which to build. DNA did not "create itself".
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-11-2009, 10:51 PM
Pipette Filler
Points: 44, Level: 1 Points: 44, Level: 1 Points: 44, Level: 1
Activity: 0% Activity: 0% Activity: 0%
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Default Re: Counterargument evolution origin of life.

Not much to add here. Just that I agree with cynedyr. Your creationist simply does not understand the current state of the science behind DNA, RNA, and proteins.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
counterargument , evolution , life , origin


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Breakthrough in Cosmology Kazmer Ujvarosy Botany Forum 0 05-21-2004 06:50 AM
Breakthrough in Cosmology Kazmer Ujvarosy Forum Biologie 0 05-21-2004 06:32 AM
Physics and Life - by Paul Davies Laurent Physics Forum 6 01-15-2004 04:17 PM


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:05 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005 - 2012 Molecular Station | All Rights Reserved
Page generated in 0.14086 seconds with 16 queries